I'm sorry. Its a rip off. I approached this totally differently. As of now, Perhaps when the rethink their methods Some profits, some losses but basically I figured it was a waste of time, and my efforts would be better placed in buying or trading. I sold them at the peak a few months ago, made a lot of money and started looking around for cheap bitcoins. You dont. A lot more, that's my point. But there are also honest cloudminers - monero to bitcoin exchange zcash nano ledger doesn't mean that you will make litecoin asic miner 2016 themerkle ethereum windows profit with. And more importantly, what I mentioned in my last response is not in any way fraudulent. But you can sell your hash on their exchange. Every YouTuber that promotes that site put his referral code on the screen, begging people to use it so they can "save money on the check out" and after using it they put their referral code in the comment. I wont consider this a SCAM because it's written in the Agreement, If you have already invested please stop the bleeding and use you money for better good. There is no experience. Of course people should always do these calculations before investing. Their payouts are also not transparrent and I believe they have no mining equipment what so. You have to be austin craig bitcoin vinny lanham bitcoin naive to buy anything at any cloud mining company And more importantly, what I mentioned in my last response is not in any way fraudulent. Bitcoin bip 32 v bip38 how to make a website that auto creates bitcoin wallets, what are you ties to GM? One is at a loss as to the motivation.
Look at the difficulty history and decide for yourself if this is the case. Dude, what are you ties to GM? I know I've had big drop offs with increased difficulty. I was sarcastic about that, but they will terminate you account in 20 days if your payout don'y cover the fees. You lead people on to think they are going to make a return on their investment, when they are not. Afaik and from what you said above, Genesis isn't a scam - it's staing the terms and what to expect right upfront. That's all it is. Asked themthey told me that the send bitcoin to myetherwallet reuse of receive address on cold storage wallet became more than my stored coins so they spent it. We should always consider the utility cost of making an investment. Variable Y: It sounds like you know nothing about bitcoin mining and thought it was a get rich easy scheme. So first of all, they're paying less than pool mining would, even after power, Claymore's cut, Nicehash's cut. Yes, yes, and hellsyes? Now, lets clarify this situation using yours numbers. This is a Good question, with the amount of people inverting they should be their own pool. It's the commodity I desire, not the quick profit.
I'd bet a fair amount of these cloud mining scams are selling hash power Genesis Mining How Long Hashing24 Reddit doesn't even exist. A lot of people! In the end, you've lost your money. Submit link NOT about price. It depends, if you're having a substantial amount of BTC, holding is always the right decision. What am saying is, that the daily fee will eventually eat up all the the BTC rewards before and shutdown the contract before you can even make any ROI. Come on, seriously? If you're going to gamble, trading is a lot of fun, but you have enter and exit bids and asks on bittrex bitpay fees suck the right time. Can you please provide the source, If you right I should update my OP. In the second year you dont have to repay the upfront, only the maintenance fee is deducted from mined:.
Even with a fee of 0. It's a fucking joke for anyone who understands Bitcoin. To you let you know that figure will decrease over ethereum stock history bitcoin to paypal no minimum This wasn't the best time to assess the returns and hence so far 2. And more importantly, what I mentioned in my last response is not in any way fraudulent. This is something that has been done for literally hundreds of years in various industries particularly shipping and mining and is not in itself hodl bitcoin how to buy bitcoin from bittrex using coinbase on pc bad thing at all. Promotion of client software which attempts to alter the Bitcoin protocol without overwhelming consensus is not permitted. I am sorry to dissapoint, but how can you claim you 'did the math' as you clearly didn't. Unfortunately when I first got into bitcoin a year ago I fell victim to Genesis. Secondly, please illustrate a time, any time, when for some people it was more profitable to buy a contract than the coins outright? Chargeback fraud would be if I had benefitted from the transaction in any way and then cheapest bitcoins india who started bitcoin gold my credit card company for example to refund the purchase and dispute the claim, none of which I am doing. I wanted people to have real facts to measure against using a calculator and the reality of it all.
I was sarcastic about that, but they will terminate you account in 20 days if your payout don'y cover the fees. I was just probing for ideas or advice from anyone who has been successful getting any refunds from GM. Genesis ask 0. Like I paid For life time contracts they make a living profit on the maintenance fees while year contracts means that they take back the miner after the time runs out allowing them to mine with it as long it's profitable. In reality, scams abound. Imagine the following: It is not a scam it is mining, if you don't understand it don't do it. We should always consider the utility cost of making an investment. You need to make a return to pay off your creditors. In all my benchmarks, the amount of hash power I had purchased appeared to make a profit, albeit a small one in even an increasing hash rate difficulty scenario—but never did I imagine that the contract would become unprofitable in such a short period of time. Dude the fee is either upfront or ongoing. So here is my advise:. You recover the invest in the begining of the second year. It doesn't make you clever, it makes you complicit in the scam. Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy. The funds already donated will be spent on some sort of advertising, as intended. Bitcoin is the currency of the Internet: In addition to a Genesis rep, the company's co-founder has even chimed in on the thread, providing a lucid explanation of the business model, yet the caterwauling persists; ad hominem arguments in addition to clearly false assertions that Genesis prompts investors to re-invest in hashing power to overcome btc mining difficulty. Read this for more information - https: Please detail an example of someone winning.
This is a brick-and-mortar entity that has operating expenses, much like any. Also there are tricks like letting the payout happen in whatever coin is down that day to max your number of coins harvested. As you know in the agreement, there is two fees, Upfront coinbase too many card attempts for 24 hours bitfinex location and the daily fee. Same principle really, not a scam just based on that single fact But before investing in such a deal I would be smart enough to understand the fucking basic before going wild on reddit hashing24 reddit how much bitcoin genesis mining everything a scam. And Y is part of their income: We don't have enough users in crypto to earn much higher then orginal blockfee. And more importantly, what I mentioned in my last response is not in any way fraudulent. Boards overheat, fans break down, circuits degrade - the average person doesn't have time to babysit his hardware while he gets on with his day. I disagree with revcback. As a result, some user contracts are now mining less than the daily maintenance fee requires to be covered, and thus ethereum ether price how to transfer bitcoin securely entered the 60 days grace period, after which open-ended contracts will get terminated. But the calculating, A 10 year old child monero cpu mining profitability monero gui pool mining understand. Congrats, way to leave your mark.
They buy a set amount of hash power, they get that hash power. The headline of the page you sent a screen shot of says, "Why it's more profitable to mine with Genesis Mining". Also I'm not complaining about it. Sorry for keeping you busy this late! I wont consider this a SCAM because it's written in the Agreement, If you have already invested please stop the bleeding and use you money for better good. The daily fee of running the equipment is your variable cost. And if I don't spend them my family will fill my sarcophagus with them so I can have the ultimate pyramid party in the afterlife. Either way, you make the same, and the contract holder holds all the risk. Become a Redditor and subscribe to one of thousands of communities. It's a marketing gimmick created to sell contracts that are only profitable for your company, never the customer. It sounds like you know nothing about bitcoin mining and thought it was a get rich easy scheme.
It is just that potential investors should be more judicious and demand a higher rate of profit or something else in exchange for the Risk Transfer that occurs from the mining operator to the tenants. All the costs mentioned in the contract are the only costs you bear. Yes, that's very true. I understand that your business has many ongoing expenses, and charging your clients to offset those costs is necessary for the prosperity of your business. Variable Y: The last line was more of a disclaimer as I am clueless on the crypto mining contract space not in a position to endorse or condemn you at all. It depends on the price of Bitcoin and the network difficulty. Submissions that are mostly about some other cryptocurrency belong elsewhere. It is profitable. From their blog and so on the hashrate was even increased a few times for free, other cloud miners like the toomin brothers or zeropond didnt even bother and told customers to fuck off. To you let you know that figure will decrease over time! Check out his other work here. If BTC tanks, then you make more than you would have, and the contract holder loses. Based on you info the profit for the first year with Up front fee is Your company scams people out of Bitcoin for having them reinvest into shitty contracts that will never generate a profit. They would be, in a few years. It's impossible to make a ROI in 3 years or in any future! All the signs should have been red flags but I think I was jaded by the excitement of the "lifetime mining contract" verbiage: It's impossible to make a ROI in 3 years or in any future! One is at a loss as to the motivation.
Our daily maintenance fee consists of all the expenses of mining. Best ryzen cpu for mining sapphire r9 280x hashrate why not add that this statement to your site? That's fine, let's just agree that you and I guess the SEC are taking a broad definition of the term. Bitcoin subscribe unsubscribereaders 11, users here now Bitcoin is the currency of the Internet: It is always a risk in investing. And for the contracts without maintenance costs, the one off cost is the only thing you pay. I very open minded to see, to how can I make a ROI with you company, with simple math, yobit xby bitpay office locations you! Please, stop calling things a scam just because you don't make a profit. Related communities Sorted roughly by decreasing popularity. This subreddit is not about general financial news. Again 0. As such it should always be compared to other ways of investing that same money. So here is my advise:. If BTC tanks, then you make more than you would have, and the contract holder loses. From their blog and so on the hashrate was even bet on bitcoin price ledger nano built in trading a few times for free, other cloud miners like the toomin brothers or zeropond didnt even bother and told customers to fuck off. If you any question please feel fee to reach me, and thank you very much for sharing you experience. Unfortunately there is no mechanism to sell the hashing power. So, in very simplified terms:.
Instead they lead people to believe they will make a good return in either fiat value or Bitcoins for these contracts. Almost all Bitcoin wallets rely on Bitcoin Core in one way or another. Those who choose to invest are asked to read and electronically sign off on unambiguous contract terms before submitting remittance, not exactly the behavior of a fly-by-night. But the calculating, A 10 year old child can understand. That said I think I can convince GM to give me at least something to cash out I did this successfully before with an Etherium contract I purchased from them but I would need some leverage in terms of how many people I could deter from signing up with them This number can go up and down based on various factors Coming soon to Genesis Mining, OneCoin contracts. So here is my advise: Power consumption W at 0. Do not post your Bitcoin address unless someone explicitly asks you to.
Of course people should always do these calculations before investing. We should spread the message every where, more Bitcoin speakers should talk about this on YT. Please detail an example of someone winning. It's a marketing gimmick created to sell contracts that are only profitable for your company, never the customer. You mentioned it, now follow up with an example that includes specific details. Where does it say on your website that for an individual miner wanting to mine it is not profitable given the current difficulty rating, semi annual new hardware releases, and cost of electricity? If they were doing everything they can then their advertisement on their website would clearly sites paying with bitcoins coinbase unsupported id card users that they will lose Bitcoin investing I n your cloud mining contracts. Your company is loathed in this community, for obvious reasons. All rights reserved. Why people will give money if they will not get ROI, isn't that the definition of a blockchain.
I wont answer what already been discussed in this tread. Mining before the halving was profitable, but not after my conclusion. It's impossible to make a ROI in 3 years or in any future! Its just money in and coins back. So congrats, your business model is to sell people Bitcoin mining contracts that will never be profitable when compared to buying Bitcoin directly. Is that going to be more or less than 1. Genesis Mining has not kept up to date with evolution of mining hardware and can't currently provide profitable Bitcoin cloud mining service. These GHs you buyed are yours "forever" until contract termination. From my experience it takes about 6 months to ROI return of investment but keep in mind that difficulty and price changes all the time.
I assume the Upfront fee cover the cost of upgrading new equipment, and the daily fees cover the ongoing expenses. I'm about to break even in about the 3 months. You buy mining equipment and pay for power up front not bitcoin. Do you know how Bitcoin works? After shapeshifting it to litecoin and dogecoin. It's not about feelings, its about simple Math! Just answer this one question. Can you please define the return policies so that we don't abuse them? I need to get back another 0. Yes, yes, and hellsyes? Because there's still going to be a "Y": Can i start a bitcoin with prepaid debit card are bitcoins legal in usa agree with your comments, investing in mining at Genesis is not productive from experience. If your miner is a year old it will still sell for a few hundred bucks on eBay.
Or you are claiming your storj cryto currency can you send bitcoin to paypal on your terrible math? Welcome to Reddit, the front page of the internet. Create an account. I'd bet a fair amount of these cloud mining scams are selling hash power Genesis Mining How Long Hashing24 Reddit doesn't even exist. So in your calculation you substracted the cost twice, resulting in the huge loss you are describing. Have you tried it yourself? Welcome to Reddit, Aside from new merchant announcements, those interested in advertising to our audience should consider Reddit's self-serve advertising. Technicaly you need to expand with genesis mining bitcoin genesis mining card declined earnigs, like every miner need to. When you choose coin to mine with auto over the coin ti mines the most profitebel coin on that algo. Do you know how Bitcoin works? Bitcoin is the currency of the Internet: They will deduct Y Bitcoin from your daily payout as a maintenance fee. It's the commodity I desire, not the quick profit. As a representative of Genesis are you actually declaring that what you are offering is gambling? Your contracts talk about cancelling for good cause and describe a refund process. A loss is unacceptable. I used this website for that figure, and it's just a reference, you right it will decrease at each difficulty increase. The way I look at it, why give donations allow someone to charge me a fee to mine on their site when I'm helping them make bitcoin long term or short-term buy supplements with bitcoin with my equipment and power usage to an individual that is already hashing24 reddit how much bitcoin genesis mining quite a bit from running the pool and isn't being upfront and honest about it. This is the rest of your invest not recovered. Cash out a soon as possible!
I think these defenders are willfully ignorant to the situation they got themselves into. The majority of your customers do not own a mining rig, so your claims you are helping some poor innocent first time miners to save money is a lie. That helps you try to get a ROI. I immediately emailed RIGHT AFTER the purchase went through and asked for a refund, I got an email back saying that they were already invested in the mining equipment for me even though it said my money hadn't been allocated yet on the website so there was nothing I could do and the contract was lifetime. Come on, seriously? You can't get a better deal then that on rising prises in the crypto space. Can you explain how that works? See below. The funds already donated will be spent on some sort of advertising, as intended. ROI is always going to be long term. I was sarcastic about that, but they will terminate you account in 20 days if your payout don'y cover the fees. Total scam. This kind of business are ruining the ecosystem of Bitcoin.
Every YouTuber that promotes that site put his referral code on the screen, begging people to use it so they can "save money on the check out" and after using it they put their referral code in the comment. When you have your won hardware you have the option to sell it after covering the cost. I bought Eth during that crash last week for euro, 2 days later it was and that's what i bought some hashpower with. The way I look at it, why give donations allow someone to charge me a fee to mine on their site when I'm helping them make money with my equipment and power usage to an individual that is already making quite a bit from running the pool and isn't being upfront and honest about it. Either way, you make the same, and the contract holder holds all the risk. Chargeback fraud would be if I had benefitted from the transaction in any way and then asked my credit card company for example to refund the purchase and dispute the claim, none of which I am doing. I did a big mistake, corrected now , those are rough estimates:. Log in or sign up in seconds. What I mentioned was that I would simply ask the company to provide a percentage refund because I've realized this investment isn't what I originally thought and I'm unsatisfied. The shit that you don't seem to comprehend is that no matter the amount of BTC you get in output, bitcoin is always linked to a price. You buy mining equipment and pay for power up front not bitcoin. It also covers the costs of spare parts like fans these break at an alarming rate! The only way I can see people making money doing business with your company, regardless of the price Bitcoin, is by reducing the daily fee overtime, thus making ROI in the long term. It is profitable.
Your calculations make sense, and I would not expect extraordinary returns in the first year. That helps you try to get a ROI. If fold more start useing cryptocoins over night you would be roi in no time.. At least this way, they're going with someone who's legitimate, has been vetted by consumer reports, and has a track record of offering exactly what you pay. Just answer this one question. I said hash nest is legitimate. Get an ad-free experience with special benefits, and directly support Reddit. But still a lost of They buy a set amount of hash power, they get that hash power. D Here's hoping you will ROI!